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Last update for a month
Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:14 pm by James SkullBlood
Not much happened that was planned to do in this update, seeing how the academy been very slow and almost dead, we have decided to take a break for a month and after a month we will try again.

We've tried our best to keep activity up but since Wolf_Shadowrider couldn't get on to recruit due to his internet, we couldn't keep activity up. I couldn't really recruit as I've gotten a lot busy with school work and stuff. I tried my best to keep activity alive with the event "Referring/Inviting" but no one ever tried to recruit.

Thanks for being here while we was active. We will try again in a month time frame.

The forums will still remain up for anyone who wants to try to help out.

Until next month, this has been JamesSkullBlood and Wolf_Shadowrider signing out. See everyone in a month.

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 A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric

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Yoruichi Shihōin

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PostSubject: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Tue Mar 20, 2018 1:07 am

If you're reading this post, then you're clearly interested in the message of the title. So, I suppose I'll begin.

I want to say that the rubric, in its entirety, is weak.

There are some minor issues with it, as with anything, but there is two very big issues with the way the rubric is made.

1. In no part of the rubric does it allow the test to include a match duel. This, in and of itself, weakens the test because it does not truly allow the person being tested to:
A. Show their proficiency with how they side in each given matchup,
B. Apply their full skill of deckbuilding,
C. Recover from a one-sided game in which one player is completely devastating the other at a given time.

The match duel is a staple of Yu-Gi-Oh---- In fact, the match duel is the only official form of duel in the Yu-Gi-Oh competitive scene. So, without actually allowing a match duel to commence, you're undermining the very essence of what makes Yu-Gi-Oh.. Well, Yu-Gi-Oh. By not allowing a player be given their full potential with the opening of a side deck, the test is inherently weakening itself by not truly testing a given player at a given time.

2. The Pre-Made decks.

Now, this is an issue that hits me at my core and I'm not entirely certain why, so I'll attempt to make my suggestion/argument as unbiased as possible.

The idea of a pre-made deck is okay, but the choice of which pre-made decks have been made is and has been absolutely atrocious in regards to the playstyle of a player and/or the consistency in which a player wishes to play a deck. The idea is fine, but only if executed correctly, and I genuinely believe the given decks are not living up to the full ability and potential the idea of pre-made decks have. Instead of a standard, boring, slow "mirror-match", have competitive pre-made decks and allow the player being tested choose a deck for his tester, and allow the tester to choose a deck for the player being tested. In the mirror matches given, or in most cases of a mirror match, there is little to no skill involved when coming to a conclusion because the two decks will do the same gear-turnings over and over and the repetition of the duel can make some players sick, so why not make it into less of a mirror match and more into a competitive duel?

Afterwards, personal/custom decks can be applied to the test and that could have a different score affecting the outcome of the test.

Also, I believe that the pre-made deck duel should be graded differently than that of the personal deck duel because a player will play more fluently with a deck they own because they may understand the interworkings of the deck they've made, but may not understand every interaction of a pre-made deck.

And another point: The idea of pre-made decks gives an inherent advantage to the tester, which will automatically set the tested player behind.

Pre-made decks give an advantage to the tester because the tester has been given more practice and a more thorough examination of the combos of the deck, whereas the person being tested may not have the same experience.

Also, forced misplays also give a disadvantage to players who may be playing casually and/or players who are exhausted (i.e. players who may not entirely be paying attention to the duel). On the other side of things, a large majority of the time, the misplays forced by the tester are so blatant that they may even just give a bad impression of the tester on the tested player.




Overall, I believe that the rubric is very weak and needs an upheaval.
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Tue Mar 20, 2018 7:25 am

I feel this could have been shorter
but I agree with a lot of the points
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:31 am

1)the pre-made deck really outdated, i know those deck clearly intend to not let the game end fast, but in link format those deck are impossible to one-turn kill anymore, please update the deck.

2)All game base on single duel, the duel do not even test about siding ability, if what i know the people who get white can join the war team, if do not test this section you really can ensure all people that reach white rank is strong?

3)the pre-made deck choose by the player. This is too good for that player, what i will do is roll a dice then give testee use that deck, regardless that player know how to use it or not you must play with it.

4)no ruling quiz in testing rubric, the ruling quiz need to include in the test because we need to know the general knowledge of the player, game ruling is important in high ranking that even some people will try to abuse it to their own advantage if you make mistake and try to make the judge to indicate
a game lose to their opponent, you cannot say it is wrong, what indicate strong player is the people who remain their mind to fight back even in absolute situation.

sorry for poor english Sad
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Tue Mar 20, 2018 9:52 pm

where's the like button on this site?
>.>
<.<
we need to change that, then.

But more importantly, on a serious note:

that is the argument some testers including myself have been making, however, it is not up to us in the end, the final decisions are done by Wolf and James.
we shall see...
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:25 pm

Lol Very nice note there 001, way to bring the drama. Also Patrick I kind of understood what you were saying but to be honest that grammar was so bad I couldn't even read 80% of it. If you can re-post your suggestion about the Ruling Quiz that'd be great. 


Onto the main message, there are quite a few things I agree with but disagree with as well.

I agree with your take on the Match Duel, we definitely have a problem there and of course it was foreseen that this would be an issue at some point. At the time we made the first and second rubrics, we had a very small amount of Testers and as such, we couldn't keep up with all the people who wanted testing. So we opted to Single Duels as a quicker way to test people, as in Match Duels combined with the Mirror Match AND Personal Deck Matches, that could be anywhere between 4 to 6 duels in total. Depending on how experienced the Tester and Player is, this could take anywhere from an hour to two hours just to finish a test, not to mention the extensive rubric to fill out. We just didn't have the time, but we do now. 

So I do believe we can update the rubric to include Match Duels.

Secondly, on the subject of the Mirror Matches, I would still like them to be Mirror, and not Pre-Made Matches. 

The difference here is pretty obvious, Mirror Matches are when two of the same exact deck clash in a duel, and Pre-Made Matches are where both Tester and player has the option to choose from a list of decks that were previously made for that match. Whether it's them choosing decks for each other, or for themselves, the fact is I still like the idea of it being the SAME deck clashing, and not different ones, else it defeats the purpose in most cases. The purpose of a Mirror Match is to bring two of the same tier of deck together to ensure neither deck is increasingly better than the other, and thus taking away opinion-based judgement from the Tester during the rubric. For instance if a meta deck faced a lower tier deck and the Tester was forced to grade easier or harder based on who had the meta deck. In the Mirror Match this takes away that worry. Now I do understand the Personal Deck Match still has that issue but the Mirror Match still gives a good chance at fair points, and even then you are correct about both of those matches needing different subject questions, as they are very different matches. 

Now on the matter of the Mirror Decks being slow, less consistent decks, this is true. Yet we did intend for them to be this way, though many have disliked this, we do believe that it is very hard to find a middle ground between a slow deck with too many turns, or a fast deck that ends the game on the second or third turn. Many may disagree, but I have yet to see anyone submit a deck that can live up to what they say is possible. You do have a point but not a solution on this, so far anyway. If you do know someone, or if you yourself can create at least 2 decks that can be of a satisfactory playing speed, then James and I can consider making the Mirror Duels, into Mirror Matches. At this time we are not open to the idea of pitting different Pre-Made decks against each other. 

You also have a point about the distinct advantage the Tester has over the player, seeing as how they are required to learn all the Pre-Made decks, due to the player having the choice on which Pre-Made deck will be used for the Mirror Match. Yet we only gave them the choice to pick because if we did not then the Tester would choose, and the player may end up having to use a deck they aren't familiar with. Which again brings us to the original problem, not to mention for us to have every deck in Yugioh on list would be insanity and of course not possible. So this is an issue that requires a solution we just don't have right now.

Third, the forced misplays have been debated in the past as good and bad for the rubric, nonetheless it's not quite something we can simply rule out as either/or. We'll have to contemplate on it and see if we can figure out something, but either way I believe the player would have to pay attention in the test. Even if they are tired or otherwise not up to the task, they can just choose to take the test on a later date in time. Those are not proper excuses for failing a test. 


These are all issues indeed but they need more than just awareness, they need proper solutions. If you have any more to offer or any replies to this comment feel free, but I've spoken my piece on this.

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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Thu Mar 22, 2018 6:45 pm

lets get 2 trickstars dueling eachother
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Thu Mar 22, 2018 7:50 pm

This rubric has very little changes to it, besides the scoring and a couple subjects changed it really is the same rubric, and we have just got quite a few ideas from Yoruichi up there at the top of this thread. That being said, we have to implement some of those into the rubric as well. Sorry but I don't think this will be the rubric we will be using Snake.

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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Thu Mar 22, 2018 8:36 pm

Snake, you made this rubric post as a request, you need to understand requests can be denied, not always granted. You sound hostile in that latest response and I have to ask you keep calm when posting, and if you are already calm, even better. Just be sure to speak like it.

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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Thu Mar 22, 2018 10:34 pm

Now, this post was never intended to have personal, nor academy drama weaved into the results of what we can do. What we need to do is obvious.

Perhaps not an upheaval on the rubric, but a significant change nonetheless.

I will gather some information and propose a rubric of my own, personal making. Hopefully, with some consideration, it will be enough.



But a VERY BIG ISSUE THAT EVERYONE NEEDS TO UNDERSTAND IS THIS:

Testing Rubrics should be as fluid as the meta of Yu-Gi-Oh. It needs to constantly change, be edited, and succumb to a watchful eye often, not very rarely.

Seldom changes to a test leave very few things to be desired.
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PostSubject: Re: A Complete Upheaval of the Testing Rubric   Fri Mar 23, 2018 6:01 pm

These are all opinions, yet you all speak them as facts. I'm sure the next argument would be who has more experience in these matters and so on, but it's best to just put these things to the test rather than discuss and argue to no avail. We'll try out different rubrics and see what can be made from ALL of our efforts and opinions, but accept nothing as fact until proven to be.

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